DS is a pirate site!

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Bluestone
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by Bluestone »

xj900uk wrote:Agreed, Chris. Geno hates pirates almost as much as he hates 'porn peddlers'.
if he does have any links to pirate sites on DS, point them out to him and he'll take them down as quickly as he can, if he hasn't already done so (he'll probably deny they were ever there in the first place, but he will remove them).

Yes, that's been my experience with Geno too. He's taken down every pirate post that I've ever told him about... and quickly!

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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by knifeinhand »

His hatred of producers encourages the pirate behavior.
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by knifeinhand »

That's what the attorneys see from looking at the post on his board. He is inciting a hatred using his board so could make him responsible for any damages caused by his board. Statutorily responsible.
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by Nyghtfall »

knife,

I'm starting to wonder if you have a personal vendetta against Geno, and you've conveniently found legal grounds to go after him based on one post on a 10-year old board. Everyone in the community and their Mother knows Geno only hates producers who insist on incorporating explicit sexual elements in their videos. For fuck's sake, he's been raging against the mixing of porn and death fetish for over 10 years now, but his hatred has never included knowingly allowing links to pirated content.
knifeinhand wrote:That's what the attorneys see from looking at the post on his board. He is inciting a hatred using his board so could make him responsible for any damages caused by his board. Statutorily responsible.
Three questions:

1. What have you told your attorneys about Geno and DS?
2. How tech savvy are your attorneys?
3. Can you honestly say you actually believe their interpretation of the post, based on what you know about Geno?
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by Grace X »

Though we are not lawyers Paul hon (though there are some mighty sharp lawyers in our community, who have offered advice from a legal standpoint -- with great insight -- to the producers about piracy), I am wondering too how your legal team is approaching this. As Nyghtfall points out, it seems that there are two issues here: piracy and sites that knowingly support that crime (which I don't believe Geno can be accused of), and creating an environment of expressed contempt using demeaning language and behavior.

The latter, of course, Geno has done. But is this grounds for reasonable legal action against him? As I understand your comment above, it seems your lawyers are taking the position that by Geno's decade-plus behavior expressing his personal contempt for producers whose content he dislikes, he is encouraging visitors to his board to abuse and engage in criminal theft against those producers.

From a philosophical standpoint, I also have difficulty with hate-speech of any kind. Geno knows this, I have talked to him privately about it many times, and I have found that reasoning with him produces far more positive results than warring -- he does listen, and his private persona is often quite different from what he has often displayed at DS. Again, from a philosophical standpoint, sowing the wind (as he does) puts one at risk of reaping the whirlwind, but is there value or victory of any kind to be found in unleashing that whirlwind?

What is to be gained? Geno is not rich, we all know that. His health has been troubled in recent years. Despite occasional backsliding, he has softened his approach to others in our community in many ways of late. If the intent is to punish, what would justice look like? Geno in poverty, DS gone?

As I said earlier, I empathize with you, Paul. But Geno is no pirate. If you feel he promotes an environment of hate that hurts your business, then I've always been one for lighting a candle instead of cursing the darkness. The same good people who support and take great pleasure in your fine films are here at FF, at FN, and yes, at DS too. You are respected by those people (and admired, by me among many). We can fight piracy together, and I believe Geno, for all his faults, would fight right along with us.
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by smudger »

Paul, I think the main problem you had with Geno was back then when that nutcase Dr. Don (and his myriad sock-puppets) was provoking disruption with you as the principal target. That was then; this is now. As has been said, Geno's main dislike of producers is where they make clips which consist of 95% porn, and 5% fetish. I feel the same way, such that I haven't purchased from one well-known producer for years now. No-one can accuse you of that- I have loads of your productions and not one single one contains anything even remotely resembling porn.

I don't think Geno tolerates pirate sites any more than Blue does here. If there was a link to one (and I couldn't find it) it was clearly buried amongst other posts. Did you email him to complain? If not, it seems to me that it was expecting a lot to say that he should have picked out a post or two in what was a long thread.
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by knifeinhand »

Geno has and does lump me in with those who do the porn. He did and continues to slander me with bold face lies. It has nothing to do with Don. Geno is an adult and acted on his own and he is the one that will be held accountable. I let the years of slander slide but allowing post(whether you can find it or not) that offer my hard work up for free was the last straw. About time some one teach him a thing or two about US internet law.
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by Nyghtfall »

knifeinhand wrote:About time some one teach him a thing or two about US internet law.
The tone of your post, and your choice of words, wreaks of someone seeking vengeance more than justice. What you go after me, Blue, or ChrisB if someone posted a link on our boards, and we didn't catch it in enough time to prevent a couple dozen people from downloading the content?
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by knifeinhand »

Call it whatever you want.
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by elsullo »

(surfacing from deep lurk) Hello, if your attorney has not already told you that you do not have a case that will fly then he is taking you for a ride. You have no case. Wake up!......................elsullo :mad:
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by Nyghtfall »

knifeinhand wrote:Call it whatever you want.
Yeah... figured as much... :roll:
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by knifeinhand »

It's worth a shot.
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by JohnM »

I will mention this as maybe something to consider. Information in general about experiences I had with Geno.

On the forums, Geno is....all the words you want to describe him as. It varies from person to person. We see/interpret as we want, based on who we are. Geno has, at times been a real asshole to me on the forums. And his incessant, broken record, repetition of his particular thoughts on subjects are nauseating. But, I will say, that over the years, he had proved very consistent. And, that consistency has covered a range of topics. His dislike of porn (masking his obvious guilty like of it, clouded by some childhood experience, I don't want to think about), his need to win arguments--so strong that he will rewrite others posts, and his love of pussy shots (but not porn) (again, I don't want to know the psychology of that). But he has also, over the years been consistent on pirate links. So, don't confuse him being a bombastic asshole and taking the position that "wins" him the argument and allows him to crush someone he might not like to prove some fucked up point, with being friendly to pirates. Because, from what I have experienced over the years, he is not.

And, sometimes the proof might be in places you cannot see. I have had several off-line conversations with him over the years----none of the attitude that I have seen on the forum. And only several weeks ago, and several other times in the past, I was sent links to sites that had my movies pirated and he has, in these emails, expressed his utter disdain for piracy. This was never solicited--only offered.

I can only assume that, he probably, overall, wants the community to survive, given that it is a place that he needs as well. And though Geno is clearly willing to make enemies of some people, I think it is mostly part of his need to be the leader of his forum, as in life, like so many of us, he is probably a follower and struggles with life just like us all. So if Geno wants his kingdom, and his rules, I really don't mind. Over the years, I have seen him piss off and make up with people over and over....and overall, his forum is still a buzzing community.

I am not sure if you have seen real pirate forums. But, I can safely say, DS is definitely not anything remotely like one.

Going after DS for a non-issue, in comparison to 20-30 actual "bad actor" sites I can name, would not be beneficial to the community as a whole. And, obviously, that is really want we should care about--everyone---our community. Exposing DS and thereby other forums and sites to people outside our community is unlikely to have a positive outcome. It may not have a negative outcome either, but it certainly will not be positive and the risk of it having negative impact, in my opinion, outweighs other, emotional factors that may be at play here.

And, don't thing I don't have a dog in this race. I do. Very much so. And don't think I don't understand. I do.

Very much so.

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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by knifeinhand »

The ever so innocent Geno has had two phishing emails sent to me thus far. I think I understand the guy better than you think. I'm not fooled by his "hatred" of pirates any more than Trump telling to "stop it" to skin heads means he isn't a skin heads. It was all for show. A very thorough investigation is already under way. No stone is going to be left unturned. Anything they can find to pin on him, they will collect.
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Re: DS is a pirate site!

Post by Grace X »

Well, it seems you are very determined, Paul hon. One last thought -- it's interesting that if you look at the people commenting in this thread, you will find virtually all of us have been savaged by Geno in one way or another over the years, and all of us have sought for ways (avoidance, indifference, reconciliation) to find or make peace, as we truly are a small, tight, and also potentially fragile community, if we are opened to exposure to those who might fail to understand the benign and playful nature of our fetish lives.

That said (essentially from all of us in our own way), since you are forging ahead, please do let us know what you can about the situation as it develops. A lawsuit in our small circle has the potential for many collateral effects.

I'm cognizant also of Geno's silence recently and absence here and on DS too. I'm wondering if this is connected to your efforts.
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